Switches, crossings and signals

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  • #5043
    CrunchyBiscuit
    Participant

    I’m not quite sure I understand what you are thinking of when you say one way.

    Only way I can think of would be if you have a circuit of stations the trains go through and you want them to go one way around the circuit, in which case I dont understand why you need multiple tracks.

    Do you have an image or diagram to explain this better?

     

    Sure, the example below consists of a screenshot from OpenTTD which shows a quick and small version of what I was trying to accomplish in Train Fever (regular roro with multitrack stations). The area highlighted in red shows the section I used in figures 1-8.

    As I understand it, you wanted me to try out the following example:

    Which leads to the same situation for the blue train – it refuses to select the free lane at the station (but it doesn’t when the station is not a destination on the line. Also works when the units do not share the same line, or when there isn’t a station at all). On top of that, since the lanes have now become two-way, the yellow train thinks it can find a quicker route by just reversing, so it turns around at the station, rather than proceeding forwards.

    Changing all signals in both the front and back to one-way ones just brings me back to the first 8 examples – same behaviour.

    It’s exactly as Morat pointed out – no matter what, if both units share the same line, they will try to use the same designated lane at a station.

     

    I had a game running where I had a double track going, and wanted to create a track switch for my trains to cross to the other track, while still having the double track line.

    The reason for it was for trains on both lines to be able to get to a depot rather than build a second depot on the other side which I think would be a waste of money.

    However, no matter what I do I can seem to be able to create such switch overs other than by ending the double track.

     

    Hmmm, I’m not entirely certain I get what you mean, but I’ll give it a shot. It seems like what you wanted to do is shown below in example 1, which can’t be done because of the crossings. Maybe example 2 offers an alternative.

    #5086
    crossmr
    Participant

    Here is how to cross tracks, needs one signal

     

    http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=310547107

     

    the cross starts on the left, right beside the train station and goes to the right further down.

    The signal is on the left, set to one way to tell the trains it’s a one way. Your train coming back out of the station will realize he can’t go on the track in front of him and switch over. It’s pretty easy.

     

    #5130
    Emeg
    Participant

    I have a question regarding showing signal aspects. The signals works, but they show always the same signal aspect. In my game the semaphore signals always shows the danger stop aspect, also when the route is clear and the train continue. This looks i.m.o. silly for a game where good graphics are considered as meaningful too. The not showing signal aspects,  is this WAD or a bug?

    #5132
    Bansheedragon
    Participant

    Hmmm, I’m not entirely certain I get what you mean, but I’ll give it a shot. It seems like what you wanted to do is shown below in example 1, which can’t be done because of the crossings. Maybe example 2 offers an alternative.

    I was trying to do it like example 2 shows, but I simply could not build it.

    I noticed that it can sometimes be very difficult to get track build out from an existing line, unless I start from the tracks end, even a simple “exit” track to create a new line.

    • This reply was modified 7 years, 10 months ago by Bansheedragon.
    #5147
    Azrael
    Participant

    The Signals will be fixed, alrdy on the devs to do list, as far as I know.
    There are some little other things but the devs are good, they’ll manage this, don’t worry.

    #5167
    Bansheedragon
    Participant

    The Signals will be fixed, alrdy on the devs to do list, as far as I know.
    There are some little other things but the devs are good, they’ll manage this, don’t worry.

    Ok, this is off topic but I have to ask.

    I understand they are busy, and that they are only a few, but would it be too much to ask of them to post a list of known issues/missing features so we know they are aware of it and working on them?

    #5177
    Azrael
    Participant

    Well I take my knowledge from other posts in the forum, where the devs responded or from gaming magazines.
    The Gamestar, a german game magazine, alrdy tested TF and they said, that the Devs promised several fixes and content patches, including a tutorial, the ability to cross roads over tracks and so on.

    #5255
    CrunchyBiscuit
    Participant

    I have a question regarding showing signal aspects. The signals works, but they show always the same signal aspect. In my game the semaphore signals always shows the danger stop aspect, also when the route is clear and the train continue. This looks i.m.o. silly for a game where good graphics are considered as meaningful too. The not showing signal aspects,  is this WAD or a bug?

    Yeah, I get this too. It’s not a bug I think, it’s like that for everybody. Would be very cool if they were animated, like in comparable games.

    I was trying to do it like example 2 shows, but I simply could not build it.

    I noticed that it can sometimes be very difficult to get track build out from an existing line, unless I start from the tracks end, even a simple “exit” track to create a new line.

    Indeed, I often run into the same problem. The more compact you try to build, the more often you have to fiddle around to get stuff to connect. Sometimes you have to try it the other way around (connecting B to A instead of A to B). Sometimes the ends of tracks won’t connect either, usually I just build them very, very close so that they almost connect and then build the last inch of track inbetween for it to work (I get slope errors otherwise).

    The fiddling reminds me of CitiesXL 🙂 With patience, we’ll get there eventually. I guess this will always be a bit of a downside for games that aren’t grid-based, but that doesn’t mean it can’t be improved.

    #5274
    Stevo
    Participant

    Hi everyone

    I’m also a user who noticed that there is some issues with the signals or actually rather the pathfinding system of TF.

    Let me give you two examples, the first being sort of a solution until something is changed in the game by the developers and the second showing why the current behavior will be a problem on more complex routes.

    Example

    Example 1: You make an entry waiting line. The blue train is loading at platform A, the yellow trains are on the same line and for some reason has caught up with the blue train. To give the blue train clear path out of the station do a bit of double track before the station and put up one way signals as shown (the green dots). Note that none of the trains will use platform B even though the track layout actually permits it, in fact if there’s only one line to the station a single track station is enough. And as some users already pointed out the yellow trains in this example will be rather useless on the station since the blue train would have taken all or most of the passengers/cargo. The length and number of signal-blocks of the waiting track depends on the traffic load of your line.

     

    Example 2: This shows the problem with the current behavior on a more complex layout. Let say you have 3 different lines all going to the same station and all the lines have different length. You’ll never be able to make sure you don’t end up in a situation where you’ll have one train waiting outside the station. In the best case scenario the lines will split evenly over the available tracks of the station as you make the lines. But let’s say in the current example line 1 and 2 both have selected track A and therefore the yellow train is waiting for track A to become free. Line 3 on the other hand has selected track B but since the yellow train is in the way the red train can’t access the station. The workaround would be a number of parallel waiting tracks outside the station and hope for the best or the same amount of tracks on the stations as there is lines and hope that the game splits the lines evenly over the number of tracks.

     

    This shows there is quite a big weakness in the path finding system of TF. Actually as some earlier pointed out OpenTTD has a path finding system that works great. Also with the current behavior I would think it’s quite impossible to build an express train passing, meaning you have two one way tracks running parallel to make track number two a passing track for faster trains on the same line. Since the path finding system isn’t dynamic and the trains take the route available the express train would always end up waiting behind the slower train.

    But simply, the path finding to a station can’t be locked to a certain track on that station, it has to be open for first available track at that station!

    #5290
    MinDBlanK
    Participant

    Agreed Stevo, isn’t it as simple as trains stick to the left much like traffic sticks to the right?

    I’ve noticed on my lines the trains go to the left as soon as possible though my double slips.

    #5309
    CrunchyBiscuit
    Participant

    Hey Steve,

    Lovely post! A nice addition to the topic, which clearly points out the issues that arise when splitting lines on more complex routes. I just ran into the exact situation you described while watching the traffic flow at a terminal station.

    The workaround would be a number of parallel waiting tracks outside the station and hope for the best or the same amount of tracks on the stations as there is lines and hope that the game splits the lines evenly over the number of tracks.

    Yeah, this is how I do it now, but you can forget about keeping things compact this way. I prefer the tracks being outside the station, so that I can still fit the station in the middle of a dense city. But when there’s no space restrictions (most industrial setups), I might just as well build an extra large station where every line gets its own lane.

    This shows there is quite a big weakness in the path finding system of TF. Actually as some earlier pointed out OpenTTD has a path finding system that works great.

    I prefer the traditional OpenTTD method as well, I still have to get the hang of Train Fever and it seems it’s still possible to make neat looking configurations, but I hoped Train Fever would be a step forwards in all aspects, not in just some.

    #5768
    Nique
    Participant

    Well i tried to put signals at both sides of the track but it didnt work. The !@$!@$ train keeps trying to get on platform A.. with signals on both sides the train wont even try to get  on a platform.

    #7398
    martan
    Participant

    This is the problem – when the block signals are missing we are unable to direct or precisely modify the flow of the traffic. I hope the implementation went wrong with something and the developers are already busy working on giving the players what they intended and hopefully this will fix these issues.

    Old and modern signals are available. There are block and path signals. The right image shows three modern path signals and one block signal. As soon as a train crosses a block signal, all tracks behind the signal are blocked for other trains. Path signals work similar but block only the tracks behind the signal which are actually used by the train. This allows for realistic switch configurations e.g. in front of train stations.

    http://www.train-fever.com/2013/12/railroad-tracks-in-detail/

    #7509
    Luewen
    Participant

    Yeah. Things we definetily need to make multi track stations work without too much hassle:

     

    block and path signals.

    – Double slips. Those things are a must for stations without much space for rail switches.

    -Three way switches.

    -Rail over rail crossings.

    Above things will make your marshalling yard needs doable.

    #7518
    Nique
    Participant

    Another thing that’s kinda weird:
    – You can drag a rail over road
    – You can not drag road over rail..

    wtf…

Viewing 15 posts - 31 through 45 (of 53 total)
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