Waypoints desperately needed

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  • #11204
    nja
    Participant

    I’ve been having problems getting buses and trains to go where I want them to, and I’ve seen others having issues on here, too.  I’ve been forced to add unnecessary loops and bus stops to try to force vehicles on certain paths, and even then it doesn’t always work.  In one particularly bad case, I added a new rail spur, and that caused the old line to change, resulting in two locomotives facing opposite directions on the same track, stopping all rail service.  These problems could be trivially solved with the addition of (free) waypoints.  It’s a simple idea: one can add waypoints to rail and road, and then the waypoints can be selected during the “add station” mode when laying out a line.

    Another mechanic that could work with this would be the ability to select certain platforms for a line to use at stations.

    Together, these should make it much less frustrating to add new lines.

    #11428
    FX2K
    Participant

    +1000 for waypoints.

    I rage quit last night lol.  The majority of my train service came to a halt because I made a small adjustment to my rail, causing multiple lines to change tracks / trains getting stuck everywhere…   I removed the change but trying to get the lines back to how they where was next to impossible.  I had to bulldoze even more and rebuild piece by piece until the lines went back to the original state.  I then tried to make another change, slightly different and.. here we go again.

    Before hand it was working like clockwork… now its an absolute mess and takes considerable effort to get it back on track (pun intended).  I almost feel forced to use exclusive tracks per line, when its not necessary to do so.

     

    I can’t see it being a difficult task for the dev’s to add this, essentially the functionality is already there, it just needs exposing and a slight modification to make a waypoint and not a station/stop.

    • This reply was modified 7 years, 1 month ago by FX2K.
    • This reply was modified 7 years, 1 month ago by FX2K.
    #11437
    Tossi
    Participant

    Well, if your trains come to a halt then that is the fault of bad design of the rail network. The game may pick a suboptimal route to trains destination but will not cause a halt if signals and tracks are placed properly. It will only move slower.

    • This reply was modified 7 years, 1 month ago by Tossi.
    #11447
    FX2K
    Participant

    It pretty much moved 1/2 of my lines to using one track, when I had 4 parallel between a number of 4 track stations

    I have fixed it again now and they are again running like clockwork, the line they changed to still exists and is in use, although its not designed to handle that many trains 🙂

    One spur caused some strange unexpected behavior.  It may well have been something I overlooked, but even so, with waypoints it would have been a non issue 🙂

    The main issue was, the lines where all set up working as I wanted, I added a spur, the lines changed.. I removed the spur, the lines remained incorrect and didn’t change back.
    I had to bulldoze sections of each track, so as to break the line and rejoin them in some sort of order for it to re-pick / stick with the original intended paths

    • This reply was modified 7 years, 1 month ago by FX2K.
    #11450
    Tossi
    Participant

    I know the behaviour you are talking about. Each time you change a piece of track the routes of all the lines running near it get recalculated often producing results that are much less than what’s desired.

    The thing I am wondering about is how did this happen that you are using 4 parrarel tracks. In my experience the bottleneck of any network are loading times of trains at the station. Two parrarel tracks, one in each direction can deliver and receive more trains than any station can serve in the same time.

    The only way I think that could happen is that you are bad at designing. Or you somehow created a network that I can’t even imagine. Do you maybe post videos at youtube of your trainfever gameplay? I would like to see your network at work 😀

    • This reply was modified 7 years, 1 month ago by Tossi.
    #11462
    FX2K
    Participant

    I’m probably bad at designing 🙂

    Anyway, I just noticed something…which explains what I was seeing…
    On one of my routes, I toggled the lights to one way only, as expected the route changed..  I toggled it again and the route changed again, to something different, not the original.. so I repeatedly toggled the lights and it went through a a few possible routes for one of my lines, including the original.

    So this explains why making a change and reverting it can leave your lines messed up

    Below with no other changes, the game gives two different routes for the red line with the same signal status of ‘two-way’

     

    This also changes the route of another line(not shown) between two tracks.
    The same things occur by making a change to the track layout and reverting, not just toggling a light.

    • This reply was modified 7 years, 1 month ago by FX2K.
    #11464
    FX2K
    Participant

    Toggling a rail signal multiple times not only changes which rail the lines use, but also bus/tram routes which are near.
    Very odd, seems like a bug to me.  Why should a rail signal affect road transport’s routes and why are their numerous routes for the same setup?

    Compare the turquoise/light blue line, I am ONLY changing the light you can see above the station.


    one way rail signal

     


    two way rail signal


    One way rail signal


    two way rail signal

    #11467
    Tossi
    Participant

    I am aware of this behaviour and I can also come up with some reasons about why it behaves that way.

    For the reason why changing a signal changes lines that run on roads I think it’s because the lines are never definitively categorized as rail or road lines. When you have two train stations and they are grouped with some bus stops the game tries to find the best route through both tracks and roads. And as it tries to find a path throu roads it also tries to optimize other lines that cross that path on roads and it becomes one big mess that is hard to code properly. I wonder if that behaviour would disappear if you ungrouped your station from your stops.

    For the reason why there are multiple routes for the same setup my answer is that comming up with one right answer which route setup is more optimal is hard. There are speed limits on tracks due to their curvature, their quality, trains will also have different speeds because of the loco power, tractive effore and ability to accelerate and the number of wagons attached to loco. Taking all those factors into consideration creates very big amount of possibilities and calculating and comparing them all becomes very time consuming process. Game creators had to come up with some simplifications that would reduce the work needed to be done. And the result is what we observe.

    All the above are just my random thoughts and guesses that have some probability to be right but can as well be completly wrong. Take them for what they are.

    One last thing. For the reasons above I would also be very glad if the waypoints were implemented but also an ability to pick platforms for your trains to stop at.

    • This reply was modified 7 years, 1 month ago by Tossi.
    #11482
    FX2K
    Participant

    One last thing. For the reasons above I would also be very glad if the waypoints were implemented but also an ability to pick platforms for your trains to stop at.

     

    +1 to that too.

    #11607
    FX2K
    Participant

     I wonder if that behaviour would disappear if you ungrouped your station from your stops.

     

    Un-grouping the stops did indeed prevent the bus line from altering with the modification to the rail…

    Since noticing this behaviour I have been able to use it *somewhat* to my advantage by adding a signal, toggling it a few times and bulldozing it as a way of changing a lines path.. it doesn’t always work, but it has proved very useful.

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