Switches, crossings and signals

Home Forums General Discussion Switches, crossings and signals

Viewing 15 posts - 16 through 30 (of 53 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #4908
    Morat
    Participant

    I’ve just tested again and the behaviour is definitely that the line gets assigned to a platform when you add the station. If you have a two platform station and add it to two lines they will each get their own platform, assuming they’re both equally reachable and not one-way etc.

    I guess this is working as intended from a dev perspective. We won’t get to pick which platform is used until we get waypoints. I see the advantages over TTD behaviour for preventing bunching with this approach, so it’s interesting. I wanted a TTD-like game, not TTD in 3D so I’m personally happy to have something new. Others will have other opinions.

    What I would like eventually is a way of overriding this behaviour, even temporarily. Occasionally on my commute I have to move platforms because some issue is causing the controller to move trains to another line to keep things moving. We may need that too.

    I also wonder if this is why we don’t have pre-signals. If the line paths are all pre-determined a train will always pick the same pathway through a complex branching of junctions – there’s never a choice. I guess the one thing I really don’t like about this is that I like setting up the network and watching how it unfolds when the trains have to make these choices, and it looks like we don’t have that mechanic here.

    • This reply was modified 7 years, 10 months ago by Morat.
    • This reply was modified 7 years, 10 months ago by Morat.
    • This reply was modified 7 years, 10 months ago by Morat.
    #4922
    Bansheedragon
    Participant

    I posted this on the steam forums and the OP has already acknowledged it, however I figured it cant hurt to repost it here.

    I did some testing on this and I found a(the?) solution.

    Take diagram 5  from the OP, but instead of signals on just 1 side of the track, add signals on BOTH sides of the track for both lines.
    That will make the trains go the way you want to.

    It was explained somewhere that the signals need to be placed on the RIGHT side of the track for the train to acknowledge it.
    At the station you need signals on both sides of the track, because you need a signal for both incoming and outgoing trains, one for each.

    If you only have on one side of the track, the incoming train will think that the train in track 1 will continue ahead and will wait for the track to clear, rather than take the free track.

    #4932
    Morat
    Participant

    “Take diagram 5  from the OP, but instead of signals on just 1 side of the track, add signals on BOTH sides of the track for both lines.”

    That’s not making any difference for me, the second train just queues up behind the first one still. Could you post a diagram showing what you mean?

    #4943
    Bansheedragon
    Participant

    This is a very very rough sketch I made in paint, but it should get the idea across.

    http://imgur.com/giZKEP8

    The 4 red lines represents the track signals.

    • This reply was modified 7 years, 10 months ago by Bansheedragon.
    #4946
    Morat
    Participant

    I tried that, and on a single line with two trains it doesn’t work. The line got assigned to the left-hand platform and the first train entered it and stopped. The second train crossed the junction, also headed for the left-hand platform and stopped at the signal.

    There’s no way to get it to the right-hand platform if both trains are assigned to the same line – you have to create a second line which will then assign to the free platform just fine.

    #4947
    nickos111
    Participant

    Maybe its just me, but why do you want 2 trains running the same line, stop at the same station at the same time, but on a different platform? Wont lengthening your trains suffice?

     

    #4950
    Bansheedragon
    Participant

    I find it odd you cant get it to work.

    I did a very simple test on this.

    I started a new game, I set up 2 stations, with a single line between each.

    I then set up signals and described, and set up 2 trains to run on that same line.

    It worked just fine, no problems at all.

    Are you sure you set up the signals correctly?

    You didnt somehow place the 2 inner signals by the same track?

    It requires some precision placement of the signals, so zooming in close will help.

    #4969
    Stonelouse
    Participant

    hi crunchybiscuit,

     

    first of all, if i came across a bit harsh then i’m truly sorry, i was in a hurry and didn’t think ernough!

    i guess we all need to learn how things work in this game, its a complex game and one can’t expect to have perfect results without experimenting a bit first, especially if you are used to another system in openttd.

    in my opinion it is better for the trains not to choose alternative platforms, because it would mean that a problem on one line could bring the whole network to a standstill. because the game engine can’t know in what circumstance we would actually like the trains to go to an alternative track and in which situations we absolutely would not want them to do that.

    what we really need though is waypoints, so that we can decide which lines go to which platforms. at the moment we have to build the trackwork and signals in such a way, that a line can only go to the platform that we intend it to do, if we want it to go to a specific platform.

    i can only suggest that generally you should not place too many signals, and only place them in positions where it would be realistic to have a signal. for example only place signals directly before switches, never directly behind them. signals are different than in openttd, in my opinion more realistic, but signals cannot replace a human dispatcher obviously and for absolutely prototypical signal placement the game would need to calculate some way in advance to avoid any gridlocks.

    #4985
    CrunchyBiscuit
    Participant

    I just figured out I’m also unable to make three-way splits, is that correct? Or is the interface acting up?

     

    There’s no way to get it to the right-hand platform if both trains are assigned to the same line – you have to create a second line which will then assign to the free platform just fine.

     

    Indeed, the solution is seperating the lines. It’s the only way I can make it work. As long as multiple locomotives are assigned to the same line, they will try to use the same station lane (unlike OpenTTD, where they were free to pick and choose, even though the routes were shared). Signal setup doesn’t matter here. So I make seperate lines now, and plan accordingly.

    This isn’t necessarily a bad thing and I might still be able to make a roro-station despite the changed rules.

     

    Maybe its just me, but why do you want 2 trains running the same line, stop at the same station at the same time, but on a different platform? Wont lengthening your trains suffice?

     

    Various reasons. In some situations (climbing for example), I prefer having more but shorter trains to keep speeds at an acceptable level (not even sure if train length affects climbing speed, but I just presume it does). I also don’t want them to wait for eachothers in front of stations. It would be great if they could all load/unload at once at a station, leaving the rest of the tracks free for transport, instead of all waiting in line for their turn while occupying a rather long section of track.

    Sometimes I also wish to keep various goods at the station seperate, so one train for full loading goods and the other one for unloading iron ore, for example. Since the full loading of goods will take longer than the unloading of the Ore, I don’t want the unloader to have to wait for the loader. I often carefully select my spots to build a station, so that multiple resources can be accepted/produced at the same time (in this case, one accepting goods and also producing iron ore, the other producing goods by accepting iron ore).

    However, many rules changed in Train Fever, so maybe production rates don’t depend on service rates anymore. I noticed transfers are less useful as well, since resources and passengers seem to automatically transfer or travel by foot. Will get the hang of this stuff eventually.

     

    I find it odd you cant get it to work. I did a very simple test on this. I started a new game, I set up 2 stations, with a single line between each. I then set up signals and described, and set up 2 trains to run on that same line. It worked just fine, no problems at all. Are you sure you set up the signals correctly? You didnt somehow place the 2 inner signals by the same track? It requires some precision placement of the signals, so zooming in close will help.

     

    Hey Banshee! Nice to see you here, saw you on Steam as well.

    Maybe I wasn’t really clear in my examples, I get the impression you’re thinking of a different (but comparable) scenario. You are aware that I’m trying to make the system completely one-way, right? I’m observing the same behaviour as Morat (double signals on entrance and exit yield the same results for the blue train). It’s not a precision or placement problem 😉

    Solution is seperating the lines. This works.

    #4989
    crossmr
    Participant

    I thought I’d point out here, that I did get this working with scenario 3, as long as I included a signal on the far side of the station as well.

    As for why someone would want to do this, it’s hard to understand when you see an isolated station like this. But if you have a 6 stop line, you might also put on an express train that only stops at 3 of them. First, middle and last. Skipping a few. At the stop they share, they might need to load at the same time (maybe your slow train is set to wait)

    Again, you might also have different speed trains. A slow train, a fast train. I don’t know if the income is adjusted for arrival speed and things like that.

    #5007
    Bansheedragon
    Participant

    Hey Banshee! Nice to see you here, saw you on Steam as well.

    Maybe I wasn’t really clear in my examples, I get the impression you’re thinking of a different (but comparable) scenario. You are aware that I’m trying to make the system completely one-way, right? I’m observing the same behavior as Morat (double signals on entrance and exit yield the same results for the blue train). It’s not a precision or placement problem

    Solution is separating the lines. This works.

    I had originally thought to keep to the steam forums, but then I wanted to explain my solution here as well.

    I’m not quite sure I understand what you are thinking of when you say one way.

    Only way I can think of would be if you have a circuit of stations the trains go through and you want them to go one way around the circuit, in which case I dont understand why you need multiple tracks.

    Do you have an image or diagram to explain this better?

    #5008
    Bansheedragon
    Participant

    Seeing as this thread topic is about track switches as well I figured I could ask about a problem I have had.

    I had a game running where I had a double track going, and wanted to create a track switch for my trains to cross to the other track, while still having the double track line.

    The reason for it was for trains on both lines to be able to get to a depot rather than build a second depot on the other side which I think would be a waste of money.

    However, no matter what I do I can seem to be able to create such switch overs other than by ending the double track.

    I watched a video explaining how to do it, but I still cant seem to get it to work, is there a bug preventing this somehow, or is there something I’m missing?

    #5010
    crossmr
    Participant

    You must be missing something. I’ve done it many times. Can you create it, but they don’t use it? or you just can’t create it?

     

    #5025
    Morat
    Participant

    I can create it, but they don’t use it. A train always goes to the platform its line has been assigned to and never any other platform under any circumstances.

    I’d love to see a video of someone building this from scratch and demonstrating it working.

    #5039
    crossmr
    Participant

    That’s easy. Just place a signal on the far side of the crossover (not the station side) with a one way on it. That will tell the train that it can’t go back on that track and it’ll switch over. I have several of those.

     

Viewing 15 posts - 16 through 30 (of 53 total)
  • The forum ‘General Discussion’ is closed to new topics and replies.